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Re: version update [was Re: Closed source & Secutiry]



On Mon, 3 Sep 2001, Gabor Szabo wrote:

> > I think the guy only wanted to know about kernel updates, and those
> > don't update through apt, and for a very good reason usually.
> 
> Hi, 
> I was the guy who asked for the updates,
> thanks for the answers.  My point is that I have several system basedon
> all
> kind of distributions (Debian, Red Hat, SuSE) but all have been changed
> since
> their originall install. On all of them there are a few (?) applications
> that I have compiled from source.
> 
> I was looking for a way to semi-automate the upgrade process when  new
> version
> of something comes out.
> That is I get a notification, I read a bit about the changes then I press a
> button
> that will download the source code, compile it with the same options I
> compiled
> the previous version and install it.
> 
> For most of the cases we are talking about the bigger applications like
> bind or Apache or the kernel for that matter but on my own PC I might
> want to do the same thing with a lot of small (less used) applications
> as well.
> 
> I cannot and do not want to rely on the latest version from the original 
> distribution as I used special options when compiled and because it
> might take a lot of time till my distro creates a package of the
> latest version of Apache.

One of the design requirements of RPM (and deb, and any other decent
package system) is that you can update the packages easily when the
upstream source updates.

You can read in the Maximum RPM book (http://rpmdp.org/rpmbook) about
"Pristine sources" (if I got the name right).

Your distro's source package contains the upstream sources, together with
some patches, and with build instructions (to automate the build process).

So what you can do is use the current source package, and simply replace
the upstream tarball (and do the other required changes).

This is not always as simple as that (some of the patches may no longer
apply, the build process may have changed, etc.), but generally this
works.

Also note that most distros (I'm not sure about SuSE, but Mandrake and
Redhat, and to some extent - debian) have an "unstable" version of their
distro, where many of the packages are more up-to-date. Source packages
from there are often a useful reference, if not compile as-is on your
system.

> > the question is, why stay on the tip of the latest kernel patch? are you
> > really happy to risk compiling each and every one of them? 
> now that is a good point but I don't necessarily want to install every
> version
> but I would like to get informed and when I decide to install 
> I don't want to do all the manual work again.

the kernel packages of redhat and mandrake are horrible beasts, loaded
with patches. updating them is not for the faint of heart, as you're bound
to break quite a few patches with every kernel update.

Debians's kernel packages are intended for use by normal developers.

> 
> OK. So I can write all kind of perl scripts to check the appropriate web
> sites
> for the latest versions, download them and even to run the compilation and
> eventually that will happen but I don't wan't to invent the wheel so I
> asked.

Do you have to stay on top of _all_ the packages? This is not a task for a
single person. What you _can_ do, is keep a system that is in sync with
(redhat) rawhide, (mandrake) cooker or (debian) unstable. At least with
debian and Mandrake this syncronization can be done out-of-the-box, and I
figure that even for rawhide it is possible to do so.

> 
> The above process might bring me to a distribution that has a very 
> small set of core applications that come compiled and all the rest
> of the applications come only as a link to the source code and a set of
> options to compile the project. Then I can change the set of options
> for each individual package and still remain within the real of the
> distribution.
> Am I talking about Debian actually or am talking just plain nonsense ?

The real question is "why live on the bleadig edge"?

If a system works well, you generally don't need to touch it (except
security updates and such).

-- 
Tzafrir Cohen
mailto:tzafrir@technion.ac.il
http://www.technion.ac.il/~tzafrir


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